Seeing from the Outside In: Why Transformation Requires the Outsider's Eye

A conversation with Kenji Govaers on how minority perspectives drive real change, in companies, countries, and cinema.

Kenji Govaers is a multicultural business leader born to a French father and a Japanese mother. After starting as a sales engineer in the 1980s in Japan, he transitioned to consulting, helping establish Mars & Co. offices across San Francisco, Tokyo, and Shanghai.

He spent nearly two decades at Bain & Company as Partner and Tokyo office Director, specializing in corporate transformation. Beyond consulting, he serves on boards including Okinawa Institute of Science and Technology and UWC ISAK Japan.

In October 2024, he launched NyuuLy, a platform supporting foreign residents' integration into Japan. He actively angel invests in mission-driven startups including ZooKeep, addressing Japan's demographic and talent challenges.

The Strategic Value of the Margin

"The clash of ideas and points of view often leads to better outcomes." 
Kenji Govaers, founder of NyuuLy and angel investor of ZooKeep, shared the importance of outsider perspective and concerns on Japan's lack of outsider exposure

Kenji Govaers has spent his entire career leveraging what most people would consider a disadvantage. Born in 1960s France to a French father and Japanese mother, he was the kid other children thought was Vietnamese. By the time people understood what Japan was, he'd moved to the United States. When he finally settled in Japan 26 years ago, he arrived as the perpetual foreigner who somehow understood the place better than most locals.

This isn't a story about cultural confusion. It's about competitive advantage.

When Fuminori sits down with Kenji to discuss his newly launched venture NyuuLy, a platform helping foreign residents integrate into Japan, and his investment in ZooKeep, their conversation centers on a single operational insight: the outsider's perspective isn't a disadvantage to overcome. It's a differentiated capability that drives transformation where conventional approaches fail.

Out of the Gate: Solving Market Friction

"We do it for Japan," Kenji says when asked about NyuuLy. Not for foreigners despite Japan's difficulty. Not to fix Japan's problems. For Japan.

"My co-founder came to this country 37 years ago. I came 26 years ago from the US. We got the privilege to know this great country. We were welcomed with open arms. Both of us are married to Japanese women. But we also recognize it's not always an easy and nice experience for those coming from abroad. Some foreigners have a great time from day one. For others, it takes time. And for some, it's not happening at all."

The business objective is straightforward: reduce friction in the integration process by providing services, visa support, mobile phone number acquisition, job matching, all under one roof with strong KYC (Know Your Customer) verification.

"We're not taking the position that Japan is complicated or not easy to live in. There are things to deal with, like in any new country. We just felt, let's make it a bit easier. We do it for Japan in a way that Japanese people sometimes wouldn't be able to do, because they've been living here forever. They wouldn't know what we know."

This is the first articulation of the theme that drives the entire conversation: the outsider sees realities the insider cannot.

Pattern Recognition Across Markets

Early Market Exposure

Kenji's background provided early exposure to pattern recognition across different business environments.

"When I was at school, people thought I was Vietnamese. They'd seen Vietnamese people on TV, the Vietnam War. I spoke French, so they assumed I'd learned it in Vietnam. When I said Japan, they asked, 'Japan? Where is Japan?'" This was the mid-1970s, before Japan became an economic powerhouse.

His mother made a strategic choice: full assimilation into French culture. "The first thing my parents wanted was for me to almost forget about Japan and get fully integrated. My mom made it a point that I was going to become as French as possible."

He didn't visit Japan regularly until his teenage years. "I reconciled myself as 100% French. And I got reminded of that on a frequent basis."

But the experience created a capability. "The constant for me, the compass, was that I always tried to take the point of view of the other. I was always a different kid around the block. And I was fine with that."

The San Francisco Inflection Point

The real business transformation came in his early thirties when his consulting firm sent him to open their San Francisco office in the early internet era.

"People just don't care where you're coming from. Russians, Italians, Chinese, Koreans, some Japanese, very few actually, which is an issue. They don't care what kind of accent you have. What do you do? You said you'd do this? You deliver on time? Boom. You leave the excuses at the front door. It was very refreshing."

Fuminori shares his own observation from Venice Beach, seeing every race in the world within fifteen minutes and realizing that products built in that environment already incorporate global market requirements.

"Exactly," Kenji responds. "My little dream is that Japan will be a little bit like that. At least Tokyo, or maybe Fukuoka or Sendai."

Then he offers direct advice: "Please go. What are you waiting for? A few months, a few years. You may like it, you may not like it. But just please go."

The business logic is clear: exposure to diverse markets builds pattern recognition that drives better decision-making.

Why People Drive Transformation

After nearly 30 years in consulting, specializing in corporate transformation, Kenji has a perspective that challenges his own profession's core offering: strategy documents don't transform companies. People do.

But not just any people. People who can see what others cannot.

The Outsider's Advantage

"I never try to say that France is the best thing, or the US is the best thing, or even Japan is the best thing," Kenji explains. "It comes with the whole package. Some people say: Japan would be great if you didn't have rules? Well, dude, Japan is rules. That's the reason Japan is Japan. The US would be great without individualism? Well, that's what the US is."

"Every strength somewhere is a weakness somewhere else. You take the whole package. But when I was in France, I was the little Asian. When I was in the US, I was the European. When I'm in Japan, I'm the foreigner. That's okay."

This position at the margins isn't a liability, it's what creates differentiated insight.

In consulting, this became his methodology. "I was hired by clients to provide an outside view. The idea of the outside view is that it's a different view. You may end up at the same place eventually, but it's a different view to start with. The clash of ideas and points of view often leads to better outcomes."

Japan's Transformation Challenge

Before discussing how to transform Japan, Kenji addresses a fundamental misperception.

"One of the big misconceptions about Japan is that it never changes, that people never change. But give me the example of one country, only one, that in the last hundred years had three or four devastating earthquakes and two world wars, the second one obliterating the country, and this is Japan today."

"You cannot tell me Japan never changes. The issue is more that, like in every country, there are times when you have a strong agenda. For a very long time, Japan's agenda was to catch up. 'We're going to be the new GE, the new General Motors, the new AT&T.' Strong agenda. Worked extremely well."

But then Japan lost that clear strategic direction. "Some companies found the next agenda. You still have a very long list of very successful Japanese companies. But you also have a longer list of not-so-successful ones."

The problem isn't capability, Kenji insists. "I've interacted with many corporations, government, municipalities. These people do extensive homework. They know what to do. Sometimes they know how to do it, but not always. It's more an issue of crystallizing this into a very strong agenda. If you could mobilize the energy in Japan, because you have the best work ethic ever, on a very strong agenda, that's where execution happens."

The Critical Gap: Global Exposure

But here's where Kenji's outsider perspective identifies the key constraint. The biggest risk to Japan's future isn't work ethic or intelligence, it's insufficient global exposure.

"How many people are going to Germany these days?" he asks Fuminori, knowing his background. "I had discussions with corporates who were still defining themselves against Japanese competitors. Well, no. It's a big world out there. When Morita-san went to New York, he wasn't thinking about his Japanese competitors. He was thinking about the American market."

"This world view is still missing, especially in the younger generation. There's a significant opportunity cost in not exposing younger Japanese to real challenges on the world stage."

He provides historical context: his great-grandfather, a mathematician, was sent by the Japanese government to Göttingen, Germany, one of the birthplaces of modern mathematics in Europe. "The government said, 'You go there.' You don't say no. You do it for the country."

"That's what concerns me. Very few Japanese are doing that now. You can see it in the statistics, the number of MBAs, the number of people graduating from foreign schools. This represents the future leadership pipeline. You want these people to go outside, then come back with a world view."

Building Complementary Teams aka “The Champions League Problem”

This brings the conversation to what Kenji calls "complementary teams", where the outsider perspective becomes operationally essential.

"A complementary team gathers all the key capabilities in the same room," he explains. "Not just because we need to check the box, a finance guy, an HR guy, a manufacturing guy. You need to have the best in the world for each function."

Fuminori shares an analogy he uses when talking to Japanese clients: "Do you watch the Champions League or the Premier League (soccer), following teams like Liverpool, Manchester City, Barcelona,  Real Madrid? Look at their roster, their players. They come from all over the world, selecting the best defender, best striker, best midfielder globally. Not because they were striving for DEI, but because they were sourcing, scouting and hiring the best available players for each position from all over the world. But global Japanese companies operating in the Champions League of the business world are recruiting primarily from the J-League."

"Exactly!" Kenji responds. "Japanese companies operating in the Champions League, you need Champions League-level resources. And by the way, if you get the best in the world and all twelve are Japanese? Fine! That's not the point. Just get the best you can afford and fight  for the challenge you face."

"But the complementary team is not about diversity for optics or because it feels good. It has to be because you get the best in the world. Otherwise, what's the point? You might as well have a very coherent, homogeneous team, at least you get execution."

The key is that diverse teams bring different analytical perspectives, outsider views that identify what the majority cannot see.

"Sometimes you need consultants or outside managers because they complement you at the highest level. Sometimes Japanese people wouldn't be able to see certain operational realities because they've been in the environment their entire careers. But we see it."

He pauses. "That's why I believe ZooKeep has significant market opportunity in recruitment and HR. It's not just continuing what's been done for the last 15 years. It's about bringing in best-of-breed capabilities. That's what complementary means, you complement each other because you push each other to higher performance."

What Drives Individual Performance? How to Build High-Performing Teams

Having trained partners at Bain and observed hundreds of high performers, Kenji has developed clear views on differentiated capabilities.

"First: do you have an ownership mindset? People who view themselves as solving a problem for an organization they own, even if they don't literally own equity, you get significantly better outcomes than people operating as hired contractors."

"Second: accountability and autonomy must be aligned. I've seen many examples where people are held accountable for outcomes but aren't given the autonomy to execute. That's an untenable position." He gives Fuminori a knowing look. "The Japanese middle manager."

But the third factor is where the outsider perspective becomes critical: the ability to seek and integrate feedback.

"How many people can you actually consult when you have major decisions to make?" Kenji asks. "We're trained from primary school that successful people have all the answers. If you don't have the answers, it means that you're not performing."

"I ask executives: How many people are in your “personal board of directors”? Three, four people you can explain a situation to and ask, 'What choices do I have?' Not what you think I should do, but what choices. Very few executives do this effectively."

This references Jim Collins' work in Good to Great, that high-performing leaders have the capability to seek and integrate feedback. "We rarely ask for feedback. Either because we believe we're always right, or we're concerned about optics, or we think it might surface uncomfortable truths."

The best client relationships, Kenji says, involve executives who are "truly open for outside perspective. Not 'I want analysis' or 'I want deliverables.' Yes, we provide those. But the highest-value engagements are with clients who are open for strategic advice. The true client is the one who's open for real counsel. That's where you develop partnership-level relationships."

Why ZooKeep? The Outsider-Insider Capability

When Fuminori asks Kenji about his investment in ZooKeep, his answer synthesizes the operational principles they've been discussing.

"You want to invest capital, not just financial capital, but time and network, into initiatives worth supporting. If it's version 27 of an existing software... I understand the incremental improvement thesis." He pauses. "But high-impact startups have bigger strategic objectives."

Three factors drove his investment decision:

First, strategic alignment. "The people element is critical to revitalizing Japan. When you positioned ZooKeep around Japan being a place worth investing in, worth bringing top talent from around the world, that's a strategic objective I can support."

Second, the end-to-end solution architecture. "You have a comprehensive view of what clients actually need, full understanding of recruiting, talent management, and the complete ATS infrastructure. This end-to-end approach addresses real market gaps."

But third, and this is where the outsider perspective becomes central, team composition and market understanding.

"I prioritize international teams," Kenji says. "The fact that Casey speaks Japanese isn't just nice-to-have. It signals serious commitment to this market. This isn't a quick market entry and exit play. There's genuine long-term investment."

Then he identifies the key capability: "Japan is a high-context environment. It's not just product-market fit on paper. You need to understand the operational context deeply. Sometimes you need to adapt your approach significantly because that's market reality. Some founders may find this frustrating, it's probably more straightforward to operate in California or Israel or Portugal. But you have this high-context environment in Japan."

"People like Casey, like Fumi, you understand this. You have the outsider perspective to identify what needs to change, but you also have sufficient local understanding to know how to execute that change effectively. That's a rare and valuable combination."

This is the strategic capability: outsiders who've developed sufficient insider knowledge to understand context, while retaining the outsider's ability to see what locals cannot.

It's the position Kenji has occupied for decades. It's what makes NyuuLy viable, foreigners helping foreigners integrate into Japan, but doing it for Japan with deep local knowledge. It's what gives ZooKeep potential competitive advantage, a diverse team with deep local market understanding working on Japan's talent challenges.

"We don't want to build isolated communities at NyuuLy," Kenji explains. "We don't want segmentation. It has to be integrated. We want to create geography-based communities, by prefecture, by municipality, facilitating Japanese and foreign resident interaction. Japan already does this well on an individual basis. We're just creating more scalable infrastructure."

The same operational principle applies to ZooKeep's market approach. It's not about importing foreign solutions wholesale. It's about seeing the market from multiple perspectives simultaneously, understanding Japanese corporate culture deeply while recognizing what global talent requires, what best practices exist elsewhere, and how to bridge those operational realities.

Message: The Venn Diagram Differentiation

When Fuminori asks what message Kenji would share with the next generation of business leaders and global talent, his answer is operationally focused.

"Determine what you want to be known for. I'm not talking about personal branding or social media presence. What specific capability or achievement do you want to be recognized for? It can be your execution ability, your domain expertise, your track record, your role. The specifics matter less than having clear differentiation."

"You won't determine this in year one. Give yourself a 15-year timeline. Test different opportunities. The downside risk is manageable. As long as you have a solid support network, you'll be fine."

He uses Fuminori as an example: "You have a deep interest in history. You're building startup experience. You speak German, English, Japanese, three significant capabilities. Additional skills will develop. It's the combination, overlapping venn diagrams that creates differentiation."

"The first 15 years are extremely formative. That's why it's critical to get outside your home market, outside your current operational environment, and test new opportunities. But it's with the objective of building toward clear differentiation. Define your target, even though you may not have all the capabilities initially."

Then he returns to the theme running through their entire conversation: "And build a network of people you can consult for strategic advice. You don't have all the answers. That's not a weakness, it's reality."

Conclusion: The Value of Margin Perspective

As their conversation concludes, the strategic framework is clear. Kenji Govaers has converted what could have been a liability, never quite fitting in anywhere, into a differentiated capability. He became the multicultural operator who can see what others miss.

This isn't just a personal trajectory. It's an operational playbook for how transformation actually happens, not through strategy documents, but through people who can see from the outside what those on the inside cannot.

NyuuLy exists because foreigners can identify what Japan needs in ways Japanese operators sometimes can't. ZooKeep has a market opportunity because its diverse team brings outsider perspectives while maintaining deep local understanding. Japanese companies will transform when they build truly complementary teams that challenge their operational assumptions.

And all of this depends on one thing: recognizing the strategic value of the margin perspective.

"My objective," Kenji had said earlier, "is that Japan will be more like San Francisco, where people don't care where you're coming from. They care what you can execute."

But perhaps the deeper strategic opportunity is that Japan, and Japanese companies, and all organizations, will learn to actively seek out the perspectives of those who see differently. Not for diversity metrics, but because transformation requires seeing what you couldn't see before.

And you can't see what you couldn't see before while operating from the same position, with the same analytical framework, using the same reference points.

You need the outsider's view. You need the margin perspective.

That's where competitive advantage becomes visible.

Bonus Content

Q: Are there any books, articles, or any other form of content that fundamentally changed the way you think? Who introduced you to that idea or resource, and why did it resonate so deeply with you?

Kenji recommends two works that reveal different dimensions of his thinking.

“Life 3.0” (book) by Max Tegmark -  about super intelligence and AI. "I read it five or six years ago, before ChatGPT. It shows technological progress and business implications in a span of thinking that was new to me. We tend to think of AI or any technological progress as 'it's going to make my life easier', better glasses, computers instead of calculators. But Tegmark shows technology progress across centuries, with implications for humanity and the way we are."

“Paris, Texas”  (movie) by Wim Wenders - "I have this theory that the best way to understand the US is through non-US people. He's German, so he sees the US in a very different light. But more importantly, it's fundamentally about the concept of loss, losing people that are dear to you, but you didn't know they were dear until you lost them."

"Don't lose things which are dear to you. Cherish them. Appreciate them while you have them, because you don't know how blessed you are. It's a wonderful movie, not too long. I highly recommend it."

The people who drive transformation in companies, countries, and industries aren't the ones with all the answers. They're the ones who can analyze from multiple perspectives, who've operated on the margins enough to understand what the center cannot see, who've been outsiders enough to question fundamental assumptions, who've been insiders enough to understand which operational levers to pull.

They're the German directors who can reveal America. The Zainichi Koreans who can show you Japan. The French-Japanese consultants who can help Japanese companies identify blind spots. The international teams who can build platforms that work for both foreigners and Japanese because they understand both deeply.

“Lech Wałęsa” (historical figure) - Kenji takes me back to the 1980s, to a Polish labor union leader named Lech Wałęsa (pronounced: lekvuh·wen·suh), and provides context on why it’s this figure:

"This was before the Berlin Wall collapsed, before 1989. Poland was a communist country behind the Iron Curtain, following two brutal repressions, Hungary in 1956, Czechoslovakia in 1968. Twelve years later, you have this trade union guy who says, 'I'm going to fight for freedom.'"

"Everyone told him the Russian tanks would come, they'd kill everyone, end of story. He said, 'I'm going to give it a try.' With hindsight, that was the beginning of the end of the Soviet Union. It tells you that sometimes people, against all odds, decide to do something important. Not everyone is courageous enough to do this."

He pauses. "The question to all of us is: if it had been you or me, would you have done that? That's the acid test. You don't necessarily have to answer yes, but the answer is how you're trying to think about it. It could have been you. What would you have done?"

Contact: You can find Kenji Govaers on LinkedIn. Kenji checks every 2-3 weeks saying: "I'm not important enough for you to get an answer in 24 hours anyway, so be patient. But I won't disappear."